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Hunter nerf of 3.0.8
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| Heckx |
Posted on 23-01-2009 03:38
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Member
Posts: 42
Joined: 02/12/2007 03:36
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I havent been able to try raids but i did some HCs with BM speced and had a major loss of dps as i even tried to use all the shoots i got.
I read on WOW eu forums that the nerf has forced many players to respec to SV. I will be doin the same imo.
Any usefull tips that i need to know?
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| Ralpbix |
Posted on 23-01-2009 06:30
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Member
Posts: 723
Joined: 06/10/2006 13:15
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Hey there,
The best hunters I know are Daveraver and Nesualk. Nesualk is SV specced and I don't know what spec Dave has.
They both do a lot of DPS within a raid. Maybe you could ask them for some advice.
Greetings Ralpbix |
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| Maleficus |
Posted on 23-01-2009 09:01
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Member
Posts: 532
Joined: 30/06/2007 11:03
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I haven't yet played since the patch came out, but as far as i've understood from the patch notes, only BM spec is nerfed atm and it seems that BM dps is almost lowered to half. If you don't want to keep playing BM i suggest that you try both MM and Surv yourself. Because the only way you can be sure about a spec is to try it.
I myself will keep playing the spec i like, which is BM. I don't really care with what spec you can do the most dps. I'm playing this game for fun and don't want to be forced to play a spec that i never liked at all.
"Whatever you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it."
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| Heckx |
Posted on 23-01-2009 12:04
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Member
Posts: 42
Joined: 02/12/2007 03:36
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Well i did it  ı changed to SV
It is BUFFED good u can do normal dmg even a bit more but BM is gonne for now.
Pet hits unbeliablely low. while ı was BM before patch pet was hiting 900 or more some good crits also but after patch pet hits 400 and the best of its crit was 1024...
After changed to SV toped dps back on the HCs
There is no point of spaming SS anymore
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| Valeria |
Posted on 24-01-2009 08:00
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Member
Posts: 405
Joined: 09/04/2007 08:09
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They said they nerfed BM not only because it was too easy to manage for the DPS output if provided, but because blue geared Hunters would top the damage meters, something that's imposible for other classes to pull out.
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| Maleficus |
Posted on 24-01-2009 08:10
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Member
Posts: 532
Joined: 30/06/2007 11:03
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The only reason hunters were toping the dps meters was Volley. So if Blizzard would have nerfed volley that would be enough imo. I think the main reason of ****ing up BM is to make hunters play Surv.
MM was the favorite before TBC , BM in TBC and now Surv in WoTLK. Isn't this the way Blizz always do things?
BM easy to manage eh? I dare you play my hunter in naxx and try to keep your pet alive all the time Val.  And about blue geared hunters; it's true that they can top meters in heroics, but i dont think the same goes for end-game. I dont think there's much difference between your gear and mine Val but you're toping dps meters most of the time.
I could only wish that Blizz would be as much sensitive on hunter bugs. Our pets still taking the mobs far away and pull other mobs, they sometimes got stuck on boss fights and we have to dismiss them, they have very low survivability compared to warlock or dk pets. I admit that i'm not happy with spamming steady shot all the time as well but Blizz made us do it with all the crappy skills that most hunters won't ever use. All they had to do was implementing some other shots like Chimera shot. But they decided to nerf steady shot instead which ****ed it all up.
I'm still happy with my hunter tho. But i'm sure hardcore players are so pissed atm
Edited by Maleficus on 24-01-2009 08:27
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| Nesualk |
Posted on 24-01-2009 08:21
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Member
Posts: 206
Joined: 30/11/2006 09:34
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hey guys,
BM was totally insane before - and blizz was in their good rights to nerf it!
I can recommend SV, it's harder to play, but also more enjoyable
I threw out 4044 dps in a VoA25 (9,2% of total dmg dealt - a BM hunter was there aswell, with only 6,X%). That was my first and still only raid since 3.08 came out. I respecced before 3.08 to try out SV tho, so I had something to compare with. and i've had nice increase in my damage output!
Edited by Nesualk on 24-01-2009 08:25
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| Maleficus |
Posted on 24-01-2009 08:29
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Member
Posts: 532
Joined: 30/06/2007 11:03
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What's the best shot rotation for a surv hunter Nes? |
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| Nesualk |
Posted on 24-01-2009 08:39
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Member
Posts: 206
Joined: 30/11/2006 09:34
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Serpent Sting up all the time
(ES = Explosiveshot, SS = steadyshot)
ES - SS - SS - SS(depends on your hasterating) - ES
When ES procs, then fire it off again. Remember to make a killshot/SS macro.
I can recommend speccing into replenishment for the extra mana gain!
I havn't tweak my rotation totally, but atm that's what i stick to, since arcane shot and ES share cooldown :/ |
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| Valeria |
Posted on 24-01-2009 13:59
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Member
Posts: 405
Joined: 09/04/2007 08:09
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How to maximise your DPS as a Hunter post 3.0.8
1.0 Specc
Sample Builds:
After 3.0.8 the speccs that are mentioned the most are these or subtle variation of these speccs:
(01-18-52)
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=coZ0eV...0cIhxdAhcd
and
(06-14-51)
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=cxoZ0e...0cIhxdAhck
1.1 Some Talents:
Improved Tracking
A simple talent that gives 5% damage for 5 talentpoints. Decent. You no longer need an add-on to switch tracking to targettype.
Survivalist – Hunter vs. Wild
Stamina is a good raiding stat anyway for fights that have healthchecks (e.g. HWNa’jentus) with these talents all that stamina on our gear even adds to our damage. Scales with BoK. Good talents.
Lock and Load
Because Explosive is our most damaging shot, this is a fine talent. If you use L&L, using an addon to show the proc maybe nice to react to the changing rotation within the timeframe. I myself use Elkano’s BuffBars to show me a huge bar centre of my screen when L&L proccs.
When Lock and Load procs you can either spam Explosive shot while making sure all dots have ticked before the next is applied (this takes 0.5 secs and can be tracked with a lot of add-ons - even Quartz can be set up to show the debuffstimer), or you weave a special (Aimed/Serpent/Multi/Arcane) in between the Explosive shots.
Try to not overwrite the last tick of the Explosive shot effect with a new Explosive shot.
Lightning Reflexes
Simply mandatory
Expose Weakness
No longer Raidwide but good damagescaling, ~20% of Agility as AP with 2/3 points (factoring in uptime). More is no longer really necessary now that it’s just for your own benefit. With enough Crit you may even want to try with just one point in EW.
Wyvern Sting – Noxious Stings
Since you’ll probably be using Serpent Stings for the Glyph or L&L anyway, these 4 Talentpoints will give you an additional 3% damage to all other shots while the target is stinged. With a bonus CC ability on top. Fair enough.
Sniper Training
Sniper Training is situational. But it appears that a good number of Bossfights allow a range > 30 yards. With the reduced cooldown of Killshot the secondary critgain becomes a bit more interesting. There is no real good alternative for the points IMO. Get RangeDisplay to go with this Talent.
Hunting Party
Our new Raidbuff, gives Replenishment. Good talent, 2/5 seems to be enough for a sufficient uptime at the moment. Other classes will bring the same buff (ShadowPriests and Retribution Paladins), the buff doesn't stack.
Explosive shot
Our best shot. Has been massively boosted in patch 3.0.8. Increasing the amount of Explosive Shots fired will be the cornerstone of SV Hunter dps. Because of this a rotation including 'Trapdancing', a rotation where you use Immolation Traps to trigger Lock and Load, has become very viable.
Killer Instincts, Master Tactician and Thrill of the Hunt are all no-brainers.
1.2 The remaining 20 odd talents go into MM and BM trees.
Improved Aspect of the Hawk
Good for Survival Hunters because of the lengthened casttime of Steady Shot. You’ll need 522.738 Hasterating to bring the SteadyShot casttime down to 1,5 seconds again. You could do with less Hasterating when you have points in this talent. Uptime is influenced by hasterating and weaponspeed. With the Glyph of Aspect of the Hawk you can do with less points in Imp Aspect of the Hawk to ensure enough haste to reduce Steady to GCD under Quick Shots. Even when you've reached the Haste softcap both Imp Aspect o/t Hawk and the Glyph are a boost to your white damage.
Lethal Shots and Carefull Aim are mandatory.
At least 1 point in Go for the Throat is mandatory at the moment.
Focussed Aim is optional when you're not hitcapped and/or need gear-itemisation for other things then +Hit. At the moment this talent doesn't appear to lend +Hit to your Pet.
Mortal Shots was changed to only grant the critdamagebonus to specialshots, the high critpercents that SV Hunters have stil make this a very good talent.
Focussed Fire, good.
Aimed Shot has become very viable to specc for in 3.0.8 to reduce the number of (badly scaling) Steady shots and to have another instant shot when moving.
2.0 Rotation
In WotLK with the unlocking of Autoshots and Specialshots, max-dps rotations depend on what damage an ability deals relative to others. Manacost per shot is also a factor since the use of more expensive shots may mean more time spent in AotViper.
A SV Rotation revolves around the following priority list:
1. Kill Shot
2. Explosive Shot
3. Aimed/Multi-Shot (optional?)
4. Serpent Sting
5. Steady Shot
When Trapdancing, your rotation will involve running up to the Boss, placing an Immolation Trap and running back out to continue your rotation. Use instants to continue dealing damage while moving and don't move backwards but strafe or turn/jumpshot. You may also want to use Raptor Strike while you're placing your trap (yes this can be macroed to your Immolation Trap).
Using either Aimed Shot or Multi-shot in your rotation may be optional but can be very beneficial. The idea is that you reduce the amount of (badly scaling) Steady Shots in your rotation and replace them with better shots. Aimed has some value over Multi for being a true instant shot. You have to spend a Talentpoint however. Multi-shot may work for you as well.
To ensure the use of Kill Shot when available, you can just macro it to your Steady Shot/Aimed Shot/Serpent Sting button with a /cast Kill Shot /cast 'Special Shot' line in your macro.
How you should adjust your rotation to Lock and Load procs has been detailed above under the Lock and Load talent entry.
Also, like Explosive Shot during Lock and Load, refreshing Serpent Sting instead of reapplying it after the last DoT has ticked is a loss in DPS.
3.0 Itemisation
You should allways check Shandara's spreadsheet to judge the relative importance of a given stat for a Hunter with your gear and specc. The following pointers are in general.
3.1 Haste
Like MM Hunters and unlike BM Hunters, SV Hunters value Hasterating because the Steady shot casttime is 2.0 secs (1.7 secs counting the quiver). Bringing the Steady Shot cast time down to the GCD is a dps increase. As said, this requires 522,7 hasterating. When you're specced into ImpAotH, you can do with less.
Since the nerf to Steady Shot in 3.0.8 Haste is a bit less important because you want to use less Steady Shots in your rotation. However it's still a mandatory filler shot and also, since Explosive Shot is on a 6 sec CD, getting Steady down to 1,5 secs, will wield more Explosive shots in your rotation, which will in turn lead to more dps. Every tenth of a second your Steady Shot lasts longer than the GCD, delays your next possible Expolosive Shot by that amount.
3.2 Agility
Relative to the other Hunter speccs, SV Hunter should value Agility higher. This is offcourse because of the scaling through LR, but also because of EW procs and the fact that - unlike Attackpower - Agi lends to your critpercent. It is however not the be all end all stat it was in TBC, because your EW no longer affects the entire Raid.
3.3 Crit
Because of proc on crit talents, this should be relative highly valued as a SV Hunter. It increases the uptime of EW and Hunting Party and increases your Pets focusregen. Crits return mana through TotHunt as well.
3.4 Attack Power
New and improved, now with scaling through Raidbuffs. Still counts towards your Pets Attack Power at 22%.
3.5 Intellect
Intellect has become a very relevant stat for Hunters including SV Hunters to the point that we should no longer value Rogue gear as highly as we did in TBC. The reason is twofold.
1. Carefull Aim gives 1 AP for each Int with three talentpoints invested.
2. More Int means a higher manapool, thus a higher return from the ReplenishmentBuff that Hunting Party lends and a higher return when in AotViper, thus less time spent in AotViper.
In 25-men Raids you are pretty much guaranteed all manaregenerationbuffs and probably have little manaproblems. In 10-men raiding however mana is a very big concern, mind this in your itemisation reflections.
3.6 Weaponspeed
With the unlocking of Autoshots and Specialshots, weaponspeed no longer dictates the weapon of choice. DPS is the most relevant, followed by the stats on said weapon. After that, a slow weapon may be better because some shots do not use normalised speed in the damagecalculations, leading slow weapons to do more damage. On the other hand, all sorts of on hit/crit effects/procs benefit from a fast weapon.
4.0 Glyphs
4.1 Major
Glyph of Aspect of the Hawk makes less points in Hawk mandatory to reach the soft hastecap. After the soft cap, 6% haste to autoshots is not bad either, also increases Quick Shots uptime. Also valuable in speccs with only 1 or 2 points in Imp Ao/tHawk.
Glyph of Steady Shot
Glyph of Serpent Sting (Allows extra Steady Shots and Explosive Shots before reapplication)
4.2 Minor
Glyph of Mend Pet (Allows the pet to gain happiness in combat)
Glyph of Revive Pet (Allows a faster pet rez during pushback spells)
Glyph of Feign Death (Allows more frequent threatdumps)
Edited by Valeria on 24-01-2009 14:57
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| surefire |
Posted on 25-01-2009 00:31
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Member
Posts: 134
Joined: 28/12/2008 14:57
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Been reading up on al this pretty solidly for the last three days I have always liked the idea of suvival spec and to be honest am happy I can now play it. Probably mos of what I have read is written above just in many different forms. In the end it is more to do with how you play the game I spent 400g respeccing and tweaking to get a build that suits my play style the most and it really is worth trying them out for yourself. Macro dps is pretty much gone you need to be pushig your buttons looking at any changes to your cooldowns. From what I have read the rotation should be something like,
Explod shot
Serpent sting (t hopefully proc lock and load)
Aimed Shot
steady shot
steady shot
steady shot (depnding on your haste rating you might get 4th shot in before ES comes off cooldown). When kill shot is up keep an eye on it and replace it in your rotation as soon as you can.
When your Lock and Load procs you should be loking at a
ES
SS
ES
SS
At all times from your firs fire make sure you keep serpent sting up and running as this keeps your lock and load chances running.
I also have been sent a hunter spreadsheet allowing you to put all your info in it gear pet race buffs enchants gems everything really and then it will give you ideas and thoughts for builds shot rotations upgrade clues for dps and they like if anyone wants it just send me your e-mail.
The concepts of trap dancing are worth a look at if yo think your timing and basic feel of the skill is good fo you (Not my cup of tea) I went for the increased range dps (but in doing that you need to make sure you are not outside the range of many raid buffs aoe type buffs which could hamper you a litle dps wise.
Edited by surefire on 25-01-2009 00:41
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| Versipellis |
Posted on 25-01-2009 22:36
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Member
Posts: 349
Joined: 15/05/2007 22:45
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god bless every hand that nerfs hunters.. lol
DPS with a "tude".. How suprising..
You can run.. But you just die tired.. |
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| Valeria |
Posted on 26-01-2009 12:54
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Member
Posts: 405
Joined: 09/04/2007 08:09
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TOP DPS BEAST MASTERY BUILDS POST PATCH 3.0.8
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The following builds are currently believed to offer Top DPS for a Beast Master in a Raid Environment:
1. 53-11-7 (Tobin's Build)
Tobin (Night Elf), US Dalvengyr (20-1-2009): 5,407
http://wowwebstats.com/i6jvufjitzndg?...115-170250
Link to Tobin's build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=ctbMzt...t0eMoZx00b
Tobin is an Elitist Jerks poster who achieved the highest DPS ever seen post patch 3.0.8 for a Beast Master with this build (5,407 at Patchwerk, Naxx 25), and while using a Devilsaur, WITHOUT the Improved Arcane Shot Talent and while NOT using Multi-Shot at all.
2. 53-18-0
[url]
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=ctbMzxtRwuzesx0eVf[/url]
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PETS:
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This is the Top DPS Pet build:
http://www.wowhead.com/?petcalc=0md00...d00fc00hoo
The following pets are currently believed to offer top DPS for a Beast Master (listed in RANDOM order):
1. Raptor
2. Cat
3. Devilsaur
***Some preliminary testing (as well as Shenandra's Spreadsheet) indicates that a RAPTOR MAY offer higher dps than a CAT in SOME raid scenarios.
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HIT RATING
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Every 32.79 hit rating grants another 1% hit at 80. To stop missing against raid bosses, you need:
263 hit rating - normal
230 hit rating – with Draenai aura
164 hit rating - with 3/3 FA
131 hit rating – with 3/3 FA and Draenai aura
(In PVP you need only 5% hit, or 164 without FA or aura)
(Credit: Agiri, US Boulderfist)
Point 1: It has been argued exhaustively at EJ that the Hunter Hit Cap is 8% (eight percent) not 9%.
Point 2: Thus, the hit rating cap is 263.
Point 3: Since Alliance Hunters always have Draenei in their raids, the cap becomes 230 for them.
Point 4: It has been argued exhaustively at EJ, that when aiming for top DPS, Focused Aim is the first talent to go (0/3) because:
a. The hit benefit from Focused AIm does NOT and I repeat does NOT get transferred over to your pet.
b. There is so much hit rating in mail gear, that reaching 230 without any buff is not hard at all.
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| Maleficus |
Posted on 26-01-2009 15:57
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Member
Posts: 532
Joined: 30/06/2007 11:03
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Thanks for the great info Val |
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| AaronPatton |
Posted on 29-01-2009 08:44
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Member
Posts: 158
Joined: 09/09/2008 16:44
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pfft hunters,mages topping Dps meters. I hope ulduar isnt a AE fest like naxx is |
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| Valeria |
Posted on 30-01-2009 10:47
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Member
Posts: 405
Joined: 09/04/2007 08:09
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The Grenade has spoken, Respect!
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