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Main/ALt raids
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| Rocked |
Posted on 18-04-2012 20:39
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Member
Posts: 200
Joined: 18/03/2009 16:34
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Time to have your say on the this matter for those who where in the raid tonight,
Make it constructive and make it sensible.
Think about Logic not LOOT!
Peace Out
Enhanced in every way!
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| Drakess |
Posted on 18-04-2012 22:12
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Member
Posts: 275
Joined: 11/10/2006 22:30
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There's good and bad sides to this:
Good: Bringing alts to get a raid going, rather than no raid at all, seems like a good idea to me. As long as the player who is bringing this alt character is happy with it.
Bad: Bringing alts to a main character raid, who can roll over main spec players, is just ludacris - we've never done it before - and I'd prefer it if we kept it that way. It's a main progression raid, for the main characters to get gear, not for alts. That's why we have alt runs.
Conclusion: No alts in a main raid, unless the a main is willing to swap to an alt to get a raid going. Hope that doesn't sound too crazy... 
Drakess 85 Hunter :: Drakeals 85 Priest :: Drakeon 70 Rogue :: Drakawarf 80 Paladin :: Dramage 51 Mage :: Drakexy 19 Hunter Twink
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| Rocked |
Posted on 19-04-2012 02:24
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Posts: 200
Joined: 18/03/2009 16:34
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Thats what we have been doing really mate and the numbers have gone down, People dont want to play alts to gear others up with no rewards.
As someone said to me and this is a Quote "I have been on 3 points on my main for 5 raids now and not played my main hows that fair"!
As a result these people are not raiding and going else where, or other games.
The progress raids are gone now we have the raid on farm and we cant seem to get people to want to do HC modes so this is a attempt at getting some Guild spirit and getting people to log into the guild and be social again.
The other thing that has been said is why should these people play alts to get mains the raid when the mains are people that only come back to wow when we do have the raid on farm? where were they when we where wiping and gearing up mains?
As I said your conclusion is keep it the same as we have been doing and hope for people who have alts with gear to help mains get gear...
As you have seen tonight i passed on loots to a main as I am not 100% worried about it but thats up to me to do that.
Thanks for your post and this is only my points not the points of the Officers as we havnt really gone through it all yet.
Peace out. x
Enhanced in every way!
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| Toasty |
Posted on 19-04-2012 11:51
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Posts: 38
Joined: 11/01/2011 19:12
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At the end of the day i would prefer to do raids then sit around in stormwind jumping my ass off, i see raids not just to get lootz but as a social time to have fun with guild members irregardless of mains/alts, basically as long as it gets a raid going i am not fussed, be it firelands, dragon soul. |
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| Rootzy |
Posted on 19-04-2012 12:09
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Member
Posts: 353
Joined: 16/04/2010 17:43
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Well my opinion is just bring whatever,be it altz mains.At the end of the day if mains are still needing on gearing this far into cata they aint that active and shudnt care losing to an alt on a roll.
Just my thoughts.I would of come the other day dan btw but it was just coz I had already agreed to raid hordside sorry mate.
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| chazyj |
Posted on 19-04-2012 12:11
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Posts: 337
Joined: 28/08/2009 23:45
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like i have always said once we iv have it on farm or at most down the last boss people just dont give a s.hit anymore and to me thats upsetting i understand we are not an hardcore guild so we dont push any one to raid but if there are people week in week out waiting for that 1 person to log on or we haven't got the right roles im sure there something that needs to be changed
my self seen we lack healers so i main changed for the greater of the guild and it seem to helped out but we seem to have 1million dps and 3 healers i think now bliz just make it to easy to raid and you can clear most in 1 night depending on the group and that leaves alot of people to sit about for the rest of the week.......
im always up for raiding if im not working late and if you need help just message me on facebook or if you really want my mobile number just ask just no porn please on less its really good
1. chesney
slang name for a guy with a huge wang.
"woow your chesney is massive"
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| Drakess |
Posted on 19-04-2012 19:30
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Member
Posts: 275
Joined: 11/10/2006 22:30
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Aye people leaving once they're geared isn't anything new. It's people like myself who'll stick around or level the alts, to gear the other main players who have yet to get full gear. That part is sound as a pound in my book. But the moment you start letting alt characters come and take loot from a main - who need it to progress for other raids (hc, new content, etc) - then I can't see how that makes sense.
And at the end of the day, no-one is forcing you to play your alts. Instead of hanging around stormwind if a raid didn't start, then do something else pvp, achievements, other games? I dunno. This is coming from someone who doesn't consider himself a hardcore raider, neither a casual raider - so I'm not so bummed if a raid doesn't get going. Don't get me wrong though, I love raiding with the guild it's just not the end of the world if one doesn't happen.
For the time being I think it's ok to bring alts into a main raid, since it's a quiet time...but you won't find me in it if an alt is going against me on loot...because what can I say...I'm in it for the lootz  . Rolling against mains I can 100% accept, rolling against an alt - no thanks
Sorry if this comes across in a pissed of tone - I'm not...that's just Scottish for you
Drakess 85 Hunter :: Drakeals 85 Priest :: Drakeon 70 Rogue :: Drakawarf 80 Paladin :: Dramage 51 Mage :: Drakexy 19 Hunter Twink
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| Rocked |
Posted on 20-04-2012 02:47
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Member
Posts: 200
Joined: 18/03/2009 16:34
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I for one only play the game to be social and raid. Do I have no interest in PvP or achievments, Shame it all about the loots for you Drakess but what are you gearing up for in PvE? We wont be doing hcs and the next patch will have a higher lvl cap so your gear will be useless again!
Its great that you care enough to express your opinon on here Drakess as most wont bother and I am sure your not the only one that feels this way. I just dont agree with you! 
Peace out
Enhanced in every way!
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| chazyj |
Posted on 20-04-2012 10:45
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Member
Posts: 337
Joined: 28/08/2009 23:45
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like i said in guild yesterday im fed up of people thinking about them self and not helping other people i was trying to start an main/alt raid for DS but got 5 people to join yet when that couldnt happen again i tryed to start an FL raid but most people are looking out for them self in the guild and not helping each other .........
again we are a FAMILY we help each other out if your only here to help your self in my eyes you shouldnt be here but again like i said im just that person no one listens to
1. chesney
slang name for a guy with a huge wang.
"woow your chesney is massive"
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| Saichel |
Posted on 20-04-2012 12:47
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Posts: 108
Joined: 12/07/2010 18:46
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I know I haven't been online the last few month, and not really been very active since last year, but I got school now and don't have enough money for wow anymore.
But still, at this point in the game I can't really see a reason to have a main raid or alt raid at all tbh.. cuz most of the active raiders probably have almost the best gear by now on their mains, and probably some of their alts as well, so I don't think they would be much interested in gearing up ppl who didn't raid when we were doing progression..
and as far as I know, the ppl who wants to gear up their mains now, probably haven't raided during progression (or didn't get in cuz of rolls or undergeared) but they should still have LFR gear at least by now. and VP gear for that. so forcing ppl to go with their mains when their alt is almost as good geared is kinda stupid, cuz it will make them unwilling to raid when they can do the same on their alts.
And to have alts being able to roll over mains now would just be good, cuz it might bring other ppl back to raiding (since they couldn't get their alts in before and get anything out of it) and if a main needs some gear now, they would have a greater chance of actually getting it if you let alts in (and get gear) cuz simply you would raid more often, so you might have the same chance as you would in a progression raid instead of maybe once every 2-3 weeks (depending on how often you guys raid).
So even if you would lose to an alt once, you still have a chance next week, instead of having to wait several weeks like it is now (as far as I understands it) so I would think that even mains who needs gear now would benefit from it. both in terms of a higher chance due to increased raiding, but also would result in significant better guild spirit, and as chaz said, it would feel more like a family, and you would also get the VP without doing lots of HC dungeons or LFR, and you would have more fun raiding with your guildies ofc^^
so I see lots of things you could gain with this if willingly accept this. and by going against it would, possibly, create a rift witch would be elitist/raiders and then the social ppl in guild. it will also discourage the mains from keep coming to the raids several month after the raid is in farm.
But if you allow them to use their alts, they Might be more willing to come raid if they have even a slight chance of getting any gear from it. it simply is more fun to raid if their is a possibility to improve yourself or your gear. when you have the best gear, it's basically a walk in the park to do what is needed to down the boss. even more so with the buffs in DS now.
but then again, I can understand Drakess point since he's been out rolled a lot and haven't been able to join the progression raids. and I know that you would feel frustrated to lose gear you've been after for month to an alt. But I would still think that you would gain something from it.
all of this is ofc only my opinions of the matter, and it might be wrong in some parts, or unimportant since I've been away for so long and don't know what's going on online in the guild and stuff. so feel free to correct me on anything I've mistaken or have wrong. and know that I'm not here for an argument or any of the sort, just to voice my small opinion and I don't want anyone to get upset or mad or anything^^ (I know it can sometimes appear as if I'm looking down on ppl, but this is not the matter)
And I apologize for the long post xD |
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| Cuteprincess |
Posted on 20-04-2012 13:18
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Member
Posts: 150
Joined: 23/06/2009 13:42
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I gave up on raiding a while back, mainly because I was sick of juggling irl to find time to raid only to be out rolled on a raid spot. Not once but week after week. I guess it just put a massive downer on the game for me. I have seen this happen so many times, the same people get raid spots, get loot, get geared and stop playing...in the meantime like I said people like me lose interest then when the 'raiders' have stopped wanting to raid we/I am kinda expected to be like 'wow i can get a spot now' and be thankful. I will come back to wow, i like helping out friends but to many people expect the 'little' people to keep coming back when the game has gone **** and they need player online but aren't worth a 'hello' when all of the 'raiders' come back and its progression time again.
I guess alot of you won't see my point, as many people that log in here are active and haven't had the same experiences of continuas lost rolls and being ignored over and over when no longer needed.
In regards to mains/alts - I guess mains take priority and when there is space alts get invited, if they wanna raid. If you don't wanna raid as you could lose loot then don't raid, I guess then everyone knows what they are up against when loot drops.
I wasn't having a go at anyone with this post,, just trying to explain why I havent been online and raiding when I know I was moaning way back then that I wanted a spot and wanted to raid then vanished |
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| Saichel |
Posted on 20-04-2012 14:05
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Posts: 108
Joined: 12/07/2010 18:46
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I understand your point cutie^^ I've seen it happen for a lot of ppl.. and I know that it is like that cuz I'm one of the ppl who almost always gets a spot.. even if I've been offline for month. so I understand how you feel, and it's kinda crappy tbh.. I wouldn't be upset or angry if I didn't get a spot after month being offline. I'd just thought it was right, and should start raiding with the second group (when those happen, probably only in the beginning of a new expansion). and I feel that this should be a rule even for officers. Unless ofc there is a open spot in a main progression raid, witch obviously is an exception to what I've stated above.
I've seen a few times during my time in tbh that officers that've been offline for month just takes one of the regulars spot who's fought for that spot in progression raids. Not pointing fingers at anyone here, just saying that it can be frustrating for others. I know that the officers should have some perks, but it shouldn't go out over other members. but that's not something that we should take up in this thread, so I'm dropping it here.
and now I seem to have forgotten what I was starting to say.. but I think my point was said xD I hope so anyways sorry for not making much sense here xD |
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| Drakess |
Posted on 20-04-2012 14:59
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Member
Posts: 275
Joined: 11/10/2006 22:30
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I think we may be getting a bit off topic...but the whole missing out on raid spots is purely down to luck...most of you know my luck is ****ing awful when rolling for raid spots . But yeh Dan, we'll just have to agree to disagree , not many ppl these days agree with me anyway, so no offence taken . Although, I'd just like to set the record straight, I've done a lot of gearing people up, moreso in previous raids, and most of these people will either leave the guild, or reroll another character to gear - which I then have to help gear up...so I feel I've done my fair share.
But as someone said earlier, I'll spend months waiting on an item, e.g. Ranged weapon from DW, and I'll try and raid for it for ages. So months go by and finally it drops (I wish) then it goes to an alt character who hardly gets played, and who wouldn't be geared enough for a progression raid...where is the sence in that. So yeh, I'm doing my part in gearing people up, even though I'm only looking for one piece of gear, regardless of whether it drops or not.
I'm seeing this thread as a new change to rules btw, not just for this expansion, because lets be honest, it's finished.
Drakess 85 Hunter :: Drakeals 85 Priest :: Drakeon 70 Rogue :: Drakawarf 80 Paladin :: Dramage 51 Mage :: Drakexy 19 Hunter Twink
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| Cuteprincess |
Posted on 20-04-2012 15:26
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Posts: 150
Joined: 23/06/2009 13:42
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Yeah I wasnt trying to get off topic, I was just saying why me and maybe other mains aren't online to make the numbers up. I think any desision that gets made for raiding now needs to sit well when the new expansion comes out and all the raiders what to play again, we all know thats gunna happen. |
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| Saichel |
Posted on 20-04-2012 17:26
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Member
Posts: 108
Joined: 12/07/2010 18:46
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I agree with you both really. I've also helped gear ppl up a lot, passed on gar and spots only to see them rerolling a month later or quit the guild cuz we won't let their alts into progression raids to get gear.. so I for one feel you Drakess. I ment more if they're going to be raiding with that alt for reasons other than just gearing them up. for example pending main change, or when the raid is on farm, to have more fun on that toon and will be playing it more often And continuing after it's geared and not change again.
and I also think that the raid rules should be a bit revised, and maybe put diffrent rules for farm raids and progression raids, or some extra rules for progression raids.
And hopefully we will have enough ppl wanting to raid in next expansion to have 2 groups going each week, although I doubt it.. |
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| Rootzy |
Posted on 21-04-2012 02:07
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Member
Posts: 353
Joined: 16/04/2010 17:43
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Saichel I must of missed you passing gear coz all ive ever heard from you is "need" "need" "need" lol Ur tbos front runner for biggest loot whore!(just messing)
But back to the subject,the only situation I can see where I would be pissed off losing to an alt is if they were **** geared and carried through a raid.If the alt is suitably geared and is there to either a,help raid setup or b,get the raid going I dont mind losing loot to them as they are there to help.They need to have some incentive there for helping out.
Genarally speaking the guys who go the extra mile for guild and bring whateva is needed to help get raids going usually would pass loot anyways but I dont think this should be in stone as the way to fly.
It makes sense to me at least that If a guy who brings an alt to get an otherwise non existent raid going they should be able to roll on loot.I guess the other option is for them to think why should I bring alt when theres no incentive there.Yes you could say well they should bring it to get raid going and help others but cmon,its always the same guys doing that kinda stuff over and over whilst others happily stick to solely playing their class and doing whats right by them.
I dunno I think too much emphasis gets placed on loot and the true core of at least what i think tbo stands for gets forgoten,which is to raid with ur friends and have good time whilst playing a game.
As chaz has pointed out tbo is one big family,we shouldnt get bogged down with loot technicalitys.And incidently chaz i listen to you and agree with alot of what you said.
Sorry If my post is not relevant im just adding my opinion of what i think this thread is about.My views are my own and aint necessarily right.
*end of wall of text*
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| Fortyseven |
Posted on 21-04-2012 12:46
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Member
Posts: 84
Joined: 20/12/2011 20:39
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Would it maybe be possible to make a voting poll on the subject? People obviously have different opinions on this. |
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| Rocked |
Posted on 21-04-2012 15:10
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Member
Posts: 200
Joined: 18/03/2009 16:34
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People have voted by not turning up... playing other games and cancel their subs!
I dont think people realise how much goes into making a raid atm and I will not be doing the beggin that I have to do when I do get a day off to play in a raid. I can honestly say that most of the people who raid would not bother doing half of what RL do to get raids going,
We could go back to using mains in their MS and ill be sitting on my box in sw all night again not rolling on any loots and not spending my points. and not doing what I enjoy most and thats raiding with tbo.
Peace out
Enhanced in every way!
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| Saichel |
Posted on 21-04-2012 21:14
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Member
Posts: 108
Joined: 12/07/2010 18:46
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Hehe^^ the reason I got gear all the time in the beginning of FL and DS was simply cuz I was the only active shaman (untill dan ofc) so wasn't able to pass on to anyone else xD but did lots of passing earlier tho^^ both spots and gear^^ |
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| Owls |
Posted on 22-04-2012 06:20
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Member
Posts: 251
Joined: 28/11/2006 17:00
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I for one haven't been around due to RL - but am on my way back and will definately be around for raiding in MoP.
I just wanted to throw an /agree with Dan.
I like the idea of looking outside your (and my) own private little (lootz) bubble and break it down to fun.
Maybe the whole main / alt thing just needs to be re-thought. Bring the player - not the toon. So instead of mains - it would be clearly stated in the player note wether the player wants to raid or not - and then when raid night hits the raiders compose the strongest team they have available through their selection of chars...
I know it's abit out there - but I just wanted to give an example of 're-thinking' the whole thing...
Greetings
Owls
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